MM#49 - Spoilers & Discussion

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Re: MM#49 - Spoilers & Discussion

Postby FeroMcPigletron » Mon May 25, 2015 4:03 am

Hehe, I remember that ruby spears ep. Top Man was pretending to be a college jock along with two other bots (I forget who).

Yeah, learning isn't reprogramming, it's getting new skills. It was change the bot's outlook and even personality but that's through his own choice, not from an outside source. Quick Man was being too stubborn not to try. Though Rock and Light could have stressed or explained it better. It didn't help that Roll went 'it's like flipping a switch'. That was a scary way to put it.

And also, if it's a prime directive, it won't mess with Quick's personality. Say Wily orders him on a mission, then changes is mind midway to cancel it (ala 'Help Ra Moon in any way possible' then suddenly 'ack! I've been betrayed! Stop Ra Moon at all costs!'.

And what happens when he finishes his directive? Of course he can switch to a different one, without a programming change. If a Light Bot was there, they could bring up the 'kill Mega Man' directive when they killed the Copy Mega Man then helped the real one afterwards.

Then with Wily supposedly dead, that means no one will give them new directives. They should be able to default to a new purpose if the old one is obsolete. Game 2 bots' last commands from Wily was to give up their chips (mission done, then what?). Game 3 bots, well, they were dual purpose too. If they kill Mega Man, great. If not, still good since Wily gets the energy element. They were all beaten but still fulfilled their roles.

Anyhow, they were originally suppose to be mining bots. Weren't THEY reprogrammed from their original roles, messing with their minds? They should have no problem reverting (c'mon Top, Magnet, Needle and Gemini!).

But then the Game 2 bots weren't meant to kill Mega Man anyway. In the comic arc, they were just fodder for Mega Man to absorb part of the virus from each one. Dunno about when they were recreated by Ra Moon though but they were able to work together on Wily's orders. Quick Man's argument of needing to fight doesn't work. If he needed a new job that involved fighting, he could always be drafted into the army or against alien foes or be a police robot.

Might have been harder for Quick since he's kinda vengeful but some of the Game 3 bots were part Light, part Wily so no problems with them changing. Quick was just too influential, grr. And because of that, we lost 7 good bots.

BTW, other than the Megas, there's a Japanese group making songs about each Robot Master, right? I can't get the proper search for it in youtube.
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Re: MM#49 - Spoilers & Discussion

Postby ReifuTD » Mon May 25, 2015 8:09 am

So, is there any reason the robots that want to be weapons can't be weapons? You mean to tell me that there are no branches of the armed forces want what basically a Gundam class robot. Actually this is something that's been touch upon very little. Other then Proto Man's construction and Sniper Joe. But I'm shocked we haven't had like a general or what every show up in the book yet.

Realistically I'm pretty sure given the bizarre nature of the Robot Masters using them on the battlefield amounts to war crimes. But the use of lasers/energy weapons are too since burning weapons aren't allowed on the battlefield and Proto Man and Sniper Joe use those. Fiction can get away with stuff like that.

Anyway Robots that kill people has to be or had been a thing in Mega Man's world because in our world there are robots that kill people, the best example be the demilitarized zone of South and North Korea guarded by Samsung robotic gun torrents.
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Re: MM#49 - Spoilers & Discussion

Postby Gauntlet101010 » Mon May 25, 2015 8:32 am

Let's not elevate the RS cartoon to be something it's not. The "robot college" episode is just a campy fluff piece, like most of the episodes. The RS cartoon never delved into the issues of reprogramming or what it meant to be a robot.

I think the comic does a decent job of explaining why some robots didn't want to return to society. I still don't get why you guys are saying "Quick is just being stubborn." But agree to disagree. The 3 guys are more of a mystery. Like Light says, they have jobs built into them.

I'm sure some people would want weaponized robot masters just like I'm sure we haven't seen the last of these robots. Still, it may be time to put the 2s and 3s away for a time. MM4 is coming up and so is "Rock of Ages" which features the Mega World Corps and the Megaman Killers.
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Re: MM#49 - Spoilers & Discussion

Postby SonicSoul » Mon May 25, 2015 8:40 am

Spoiler: show
I wanna bet that after Wily gets back from WU, he's going to use Mr. X's resources to build the Genesis Unit and the Mega Man Killers, or at the very least have blueprints for MM5's Robot Masters. Accidently creating bassnium is just hopeful thinking this early in the timeline.


EDIT: BTW, anyone else find it funny yet pleasantly surprising that this is the first time in a while a Spoiler/Discussion thread for a Mega Man issue managed to get past 2 or 3 pages? I guess that's what happens after a game adaption comes and goes. When it's over and done with, we get an aftermath issue that manages to have good dialogue/character moments that sparks good discussion amongst ourselves.
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Re: MM#49 - Spoilers & Discussion

Postby MetalSkulkBane » Mon May 25, 2015 10:39 am

I would 'blame' the hard moral discussion.

And yes, military would love to have real Robot Master in their ranks,. But they will get him over Light's dead body. RM 1-3 still count as his creations (Willy stole designs) or at very least co-creations. He would never allow for that. But who knows, maybe future stories will touch upon that.
Still, that's gonna be sad when Megaman, pacifist forced to fight, will go through 8 more waves of robots, when there is a guy who loves being a weapon sitting in robot museum. :P
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Re: MM#49 - Spoilers & Discussion

Postby FeroMcPigletron » Mon May 25, 2015 11:27 am

Maybe stubborn isn't the right word. Closed-minded?

I'd love to see future conflicts with the robot masters charging in to help Mega Man, like Game 1 bots in the last part of Game 2 act then Game 2-3 bots helping during Ra Moon. I guess this will happen more often depending on the game. Too bad Cossack bots live so far away. Haha, Dust Man should hang out with Roll as a cleaning bot then join her and Kalinka is a sort of adventure, haha. Or not.

On discussion, well, this is a really good issue. I was glossing over the Mr X stuff that you guys were gushing about though cuz I loved the bots part more. Except infuriating Quick Man influences the other guys, grr.
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Re: MM#49 - Spoilers & Discussion

Postby Gauntlet101010 » Mon May 25, 2015 11:54 am

I'd say closed-minded is also wrong. I mean, it's really understandable to not want your mind changed for you. It's not like he's human and can just go into another job. They're changing his mind for him. So that, not only will he be equipped to handle this other job, but like doing it. To him, not being a weapon is just ... not being himself.

Like ... let's say you were a bit socially awkward. Would you like being "reprogrammed" to fit in? Do you trust the guy reprogramming you? What if you liked some of the things that made you not fit in? That's where Quick is. He likes who is is already and likes his job. He doesn't trust Light and doesn't want to change. And I can't blame him for nit trusting Light. He was made to kill Light, he and the other 2s attacked him in his home!

I'd say Quick (and the 2s) are more ... resigned. I don't want to bring in other issues that would complicate the matter, but you can probably think of a few instances in real life where people would say "no, I like who I am and I don't want to change who I am to suit you." In most circumstances that's admirable. In Quick's case that means he doesn't want Light to save him if it means he's no longer himself.

I don't think Quick just influenced everyone. Neither Heat nor Metal said they disliked the idea of reprogramming in terms of not being themselves; they just saw a new job as boring. The others didn't see themselves as being all that useful. =
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Re: MM#49 - Spoilers & Discussion

Postby FeroMcPigletron » Mon May 25, 2015 12:57 pm

But that's it. What did Quick Man want to keep? His job to keep terrorizing Mega Man? He has alternatives to keep one being a fighting robot, if he didn't want to have other alternate avenues (Mail Man, haha. Why was his stage all fire and lasers again?)

He already worked with Mega Man once during Ra Moon. Then during Game 3 arc, what was he doing wandering around the world until Break Man tracked him down to get his chip? Why didn't he insist on staying and helping Wily terrorize Mega Man?

(btw, I'd love to see Break Man confronting each bot and seeing how they react. Quick Man was the only one who fought back?)

It really depends on what his current programming says. Is he programmed not to help people? Is he programmed not to listen to other folks other than Wily? (which doesn't work if Wily is dead). Is he programmed to love fighting? (already alternatives to that in the military stuff)

I guess it's part of the story really but, darn, it hurts that the other bots didn't take the chance to be redeemed. Especially guys who really need it or my favorites :/
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Re: MM#49 - Spoilers & Discussion

Postby Gauntlet101010 » Mon May 25, 2015 1:09 pm

Quickman wants to be himself and not be "Mailman" or whoever he would be if he was reprogrammed. I can see the illogic of it - saying he's rather "die" than adapt or change. But he's not human. He doesn't need to see it that way. He isn't dying and he doesn't want to be used in a different way. So, yes. He wants to keep his job in trying to kill Megaman, of being a battle robot.

Anyhow, we should just agree to disagree. We;re going in circles.

"I don't see why he didn't want to be used. He could be useful in other ways."

<Explains why>

"I still don't get it. It's like he'd rather die."

<Long post.>

*shruggs*

Agree to disagree.
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Re: MM#49 - Spoilers & Discussion

Postby SonicSoul » Mon May 25, 2015 1:09 pm

Again, it's his own personal pride and sense of self-worth that he really wants and needs. He's not giving up either of those regardless of much you put a positive spin on "Oh being re-programmed into something for the good of everybody but yourself, but you won't mind since you'll already *think* it's good!" Rock basically said this to him, and it totally gives off that his naivety is preventing him from seeing this from Quick Man's point of view. Doesn't make him look evil or bad, just not capable of really getting the actual negatives to his well-intentioned plan.

EDIT: Ninja'd. By a ninja of course. Heh heh.
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Re: MM#49 - Spoilers & Discussion

Postby FeroMcPigletron » Mon May 25, 2015 1:24 pm

Oog, agree to disagree. Though they really should have taken more time to think it through instead of being 'quick' to say 'go ahead and deactivate us'.

So, Robot Museum is Game 7? I hope we see them around sooner than that, whatever Shadow Man is planning. The guys are missing out on the Worlds United!

Oooooh, maybe they'll be re activated during the crossover itself, haha. Get some extra muscle against ... I have no idea what's going to happen! Um, Heat Man fights Red Arremer from Gargoyle's Quest? Magnet Man messing with Nights Into Dreams? Needle Man grappling with the Bionic Commando? Quick Man being ninja fighting with Strider Hiryu?
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Re: MM#49 - Spoilers & Discussion

Postby Gauntlet101010 » Mon May 25, 2015 1:27 pm

The Robot Museum is MM7 and Rockman and Forte.

They very well might be seen again. Or not; it'd diminish the impact of being shut down. We see the MM1 robots on the covers, and there's plenty of good guy bots now, so I dunno. They're probably gone for a while. We MAY see MM4 guys since some of them are made for battle and MM4's coming up.
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Re: MM#49 - Spoilers & Discussion

Postby FeroMcPigletron » Mon May 25, 2015 1:55 pm

Rockman and Forte is around Game 8 anyhow (since Tengu Man and Astro Man are both there... I think.)

I guess you're right about losing the weight of the deactivation but, sigh. Still waiting on Fire Man's page time.

Marvel or DC never have this problem where characters are introduced 8 at a time. This might be unique to Mega Man, haha.
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Re: MM#49 - Spoilers & Discussion

Postby Tahtorak » Mon May 25, 2015 1:57 pm

FeroMcPigletron wrote:Oog, agree to disagree. Though they really should have taken more time to think it through instead of being 'quick' to say 'go ahead and deactivate us'.

So, Robot Museum is Game 7? I hope we see them around sooner than that, whatever Shadow Man is planning. The guys are missing out on the Worlds United!

Oooooh, maybe they'll be re activated during the crossover itself, haha. Get some extra muscle against ... I have no idea what's going to happen! Um, Heat Man fights Red Arremer from Gargoyle's Quest? Magnet Man messing with Nights Into Dreams? Needle Man grappling with the Bionic Commando? Quick Man being ninja fighting with Strider Hiryu?


Quick Man vs Sonic Man would be better.
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Re: MM#49 - Spoilers & Discussion

Postby Dejimon11 » Mon May 25, 2015 7:37 pm

I really enjoyed this issue a lot. The Mr.X thing was a nice twist(which I'll get into later not now) and the Robot Masters who wanted to get shut down is a really interesting concept and worked well but here's my problem with this. When Wood Man first appeared in issue 9 he was content with his programming and believed that a robot made of wood would have any purpose and claimed to be weapon so having him side with the Light family feels a bit odd then again when he was part of D.O.C. robot it was him that stopped Bubble Man from attacking Roll because he didn't want to hurt someone who was innocent and during the Ra Moon arc when Mega Man told him that the crisis was out of hand he was the first to be on board with it so I guess there were signs. With Quick Man it feels a bit weird for him to be on the opposite side because during the Ra Moon arc when Shadow Man was going to destroy Rock he saved him and when Wily wanted his I.C. to be part of D.O.C. robot he was the only Robot Master to call out Wily's insanity and rebel against it this is just a minor nitpick I have Im just glad Needle Man stayed with the Lights otherwise his dilemma in Legends of the Blue Bomber would of been entirely pointless. EDIT: I just re-read it, he did want to get decommissioned. Why? I don't get his reasoning


All in all the Mega Man 3 adaptation was well done with a rushed moments here and there but I believe that this is my favorite arc in the comic mostly because you guys weren't trying to rush everything within the span of 4 issues and the 2 years of build up was worth the wait great job guys. Now that's arc is over with Let the Unification of the Worlds begin
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