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Re: Mega Man #38 - Spoilers & Discussion

PostPosted: Mon Jul 07, 2014 6:38 pm
by Acrosurge
Damo wrote:The reploids, which are the most advanced tech in the X-era, are literally shoddy knockoffs of X, who is about the same level as Zero. The pinnacle of X-era technology is wannabe versions of Light/Wily tech.

It's really not a stretch that one of Wily's old doomsday devices could be a serious threat to reploids.
While I agree that the reploids are based off of Dr. Light's technology, I think it wrong to call them "shoddy". Both Hunters and Mavericks incorporate the weapon systems and defenses of 21XX which, with a few exceptions, are clearly superior to most of the systems of 20XX. X himself isn't considered particularly impressive by the Maverick Hunters at the start of his career and was certainly nowhere near Zero in power. Other reploids including Vile and Sigma were far superior to him at the beginning of 21XX as revealed in dialogue from Mega Man X and Maverick Hunter X.

The reason X (and to an extent, Zero), match and overtake the reploids of 21XX is due not to the innate superiority of all 20XX technology to 21XX tech, but due to X and Zero's unique, limitless potential for growth and power. I repeat, this trait is unique to X and Zero. Not all Light/Wily tech possesses such ability (which is why Wily makes statements about Zero's power level being far beyond Bass's level). X is Dr. Light's last, greatest creation. Zero is Wily's last and best.

But it may be too early for such skepticism. Perhaps there is a reason yet to be revealed why the Wily Walker possesses such power.

Re: Mega Man #38 - Spoilers & Discussion

PostPosted: Mon Jul 07, 2014 7:24 pm
by Damo
Acrosurge wrote:Both Hunters and Mavericks incorporate the weapon systems and defenses of 21XX which, with a few exceptions, are clearly superior to most of the systems of 20XX.


Emphasis mine. Nobody's saying a Hammer Joe's hammer is more lethal than a Hoganmer's mace, but Wily's massive endgame machines were in a different league, and could often only be defeated with just the right weapon, aimed at just the right spot, and a whole lot of dodging in between.

Acrosurge wrote:X himself isn't considered particularly impressive by the Maverick Hunters at the start of his career


And then he found caches of powerups designed by Dr. Light.

The vastly superior AI was what made X and Zero the final masterpieces of Light and Wily. That doesn't mean that the Docs didn't hit comparable high notes in weapons design considerably earlier, it's just that those amazing AIs allowed X and Zero to overcome any obstacle, and their designs were far more compact and energy-efficient. Mega Man is clearly superior overall to the Wily Capsule 7... but which had better armor and weaponary? It wasn't durability or firepower that let Rock take that thing out.

Keeping in mind that X and all the Hunters are still pretty raw in this story, and have no experience fighting giant well-armored weapons platforms that have small specific weaknesses, a high end Wily Machine really should be a legitimate threat.

Re: Mega Man #38 - Spoilers & Discussion

PostPosted: Mon Jul 07, 2014 8:24 pm
by Sonicpolo
The Maverick Hunters fighting the Wily Walker should be in the same league as how X and the Hunters fought that mechanical in Day of Sigma. I think...

Re: Mega Man #38 - Spoilers & Discussion

PostPosted: Tue Jul 08, 2014 7:25 am
by Acrosurge
Damo wrote:The vastly superior AI was what made X and Zero the final masterpieces of Light and Wily. That doesn't mean that the Docs didn't hit comparable high notes in weapons design considerably earlier
Possible but improbable, taking into account Wily's comments to Bass during Power Fighters and Mega Man and Bass. As far as power and ability, Wily makes it clear that Zero would surpass all he'd previously created. In X6 (allowing for the Isoc = Wily hypothesis), Wily goes so far as to call Zero the strongest in the universe.

Here is where I think our ideas differ. What made X and Zero special was not only their AIs, but their bodies as well, which allowed for virtually limitless potential power. Both traits made it possible for the Light/Wily sons to match and surpass their ancestors for centuries.

Damo wrote:Keeping in mind that X and all the Hunters are still pretty raw in this story, and have no experience fighting giant well-armored weapons platforms that have small specific weaknesses, a high end Wily Machine really should be a legitimate threat.
Sonicpolo wrote:The Maverick Hunters fighting the Wily Walker should be in the same league as how X and the Hunters fought that mechanical in Day of Sigma. I think...
Precisely, the Walker shouldn't be so much a doomsday machine in 21XX as one more rampant mechaniloid. A threat perhaps, but nothing the 17th Elite can't overcome. Come now, Zero, Vile, Spark Mandrill, Boomerang Kuwanger, Gravity Beetle, and Flame Stag are all a part of that team, led by Sigma. They are Elite for a reason.

Re: Mega Man #38 - Spoilers & Discussion

PostPosted: Tue Jul 08, 2014 10:34 am
by ZonicZoneCop
...I guess WC is Canon, but won't occur for a while canonly?

Re: Mega Man #38 - Spoilers & Discussion

PostPosted: Wed Jul 09, 2014 2:12 pm
by Ian Flynn
ZonicZoneCop wrote:...I guess WC is Canon, but won't occur for a while canonly?

Yup.

Re: Mega Man #38 - Spoilers & Discussion

PostPosted: Wed Jul 09, 2014 6:36 pm
by Acrosurge
Ian Flynn wrote:
ZonicZoneCop wrote:...I guess WC is Canon, but won't occur for a while canonly?

Yup.
Woohoo! I love when crossovers are included as canon and not erased by reality resets or retcons. Happy day! But Quick Man is still faster than Sonic-sans-powerups... :wink:

Re: Mega Man #38 - Spoilers & Discussion

PostPosted: Wed Jul 09, 2014 9:59 pm
by Antiyonder
Wouldn't it still be canon given how the reversal of the Genesis Wave actually made some changes like?:
- Mega Man and the other Robot Masters being repaired.
- The damage to the city being undone.
- Wily retaining a faint memory of Eggman's betrayal.

Re: Mega Man #38 - Spoilers & Discussion

PostPosted: Fri Jul 11, 2014 2:15 pm
by Mavrickindigo
Ian Flynn wrote:
ZonicZoneCop wrote:...I guess WC is Canon, but won't occur for a while canonly?

Yup.

Yay! my timeline is right!

Re: Mega Man #38 - Spoilers & Discussion

PostPosted: Sat Jul 12, 2014 9:51 am
by SoundBunnie44
I figure WC is kind of in its own Time bubble, not future or past, just a random instance, but since it was still relevant to the book, it was still seen during the time travel scene.

Re: Mega Man #38 - Spoilers & Discussion

PostPosted: Sat Jul 12, 2014 12:53 pm
by Ian Flynn
SoundBunnie44 wrote:I figure WC is kind of in its own Time bubble, not future or past, just a random instance, but since it was still relevant to the book, it was still seen during the time travel scene.

It happens after Mega Man 10.

Re: Mega Man #38 - Spoilers & Discussion

PostPosted: Sun Jul 13, 2014 1:11 pm
by Mavrickindigo
Ian Flynn wrote:
SoundBunnie44 wrote:I figure WC is kind of in its own Time bubble, not future or past, just a random instance, but since it was still relevant to the book, it was still seen during the time travel scene.

It happens after Mega Man 10.

your dedication to make everything canon has me salute you.

Though that being said, do you think you'd use more time hijinks should a second Sonic crossover happen before you adapt mega man 10?