Will the other characters ever be playable again?

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Will the other characters ever be playable again?

Yes
18
69%
No
8
31%
 
Total votes : 26

Re: Will the other characters ever be playable again?

Postby The Shadow Imperator » Sat Oct 17, 2015 5:39 pm

At this point I'd be happy to just get a game that doesn't use the archaic Zone/Act structure. Sonic Adventure 1 and 2 were so memorable in part because you never knew where you were going next and each level stood out from the last one. Everyone remembers the likes of Twinkle Escape or City Escape. Does anyone have any equally-fond memories of Sweet Mountain Act 5 or Desert Ruins Act 2? Somehow, I doubt it.
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Re: Will the other characters ever be playable again?

Postby Azul » Sat Oct 17, 2015 6:00 pm

The Shadow Imperator wrote:At this point I'd be happy to just get a game that doesn't use the archaic Zone/Act structure. Sonic Adventure 1 and 2 were so memorable in part because you never knew where you were going next and each level stood out from the last one. Everyone remembers the likes of Twinkle Escape or City Escape. Does anyone have any equally-fond memories of Sweet Mountain Act 5 or Desert Ruins Act 2? Somehow, I doubt it.


(hearty laughter) I actually love Sweet Mountain Act 5 XD. But I actually prefer the zone/act structure. It's one of the things that makes Sonic unique compared to other platformers. Plus, Adventure wasn't entirely without the act structure. Most notable in Sonic and Amy's stages, stage were often divided into 2 sections but they were basically acts without being called acts. Heck, they even did it in Sonic Heroes with the even numbered stages basically being sequels of the odd numbered stages. And really, the fond memory argument is highly objective.
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Re: Will the other characters ever be playable again?

Postby The Shadow Imperator » Sat Oct 17, 2015 6:05 pm

Azul wrote:
The Shadow Imperator wrote:At this point I'd be happy to just get a game that doesn't use the archaic Zone/Act structure. Sonic Adventure 1 and 2 were so memorable in part because you never knew where you were going next and each level stood out from the last one. Everyone remembers the likes of Twinkle Escape or City Escape. Does anyone have any equally-fond memories of Sweet Mountain Act 5 or Desert Ruins Act 2? Somehow, I doubt it.


(hearty laughter) I actually love Sweet Mountain Act 5 XD. But I actually prefer the zone/act structure. It's one of the things that makes Sonic unique compared to other platformers. Plus, Adventure wasn't entirely without the act structure. Most notable in Sonic and Amy's stages, stage were often divided into 2 sections but they were basically acts without being called acts. Heck, they even did it in Sonic Heroes with the even numbered stages basically being sequels of the odd numbered stages. And really, the fond memory argument is highly objective.

...Um, no. It is not unique whatsoever. Look at Mario. Same format, just substitute "worlds" and "levels" instead of Zones and Acts.
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Re: Will the other characters ever be playable again?

Postby MetalSkulkBane » Sun Oct 18, 2015 1:32 am

Yeah, word "zone" doesn't do the magic. At best I can say that Adventure knew how to make their levels memorable.
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Re: Will the other characters ever be playable again?

Postby FritzyBeat » Sun Oct 18, 2015 1:40 am

So.... when can we expect Big the Cat's fishing levels to return? owo
*shot*
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Re: Will the other characters ever be playable again?

Postby Penguin God » Sun Oct 18, 2015 1:41 am

The Adventure games did use the Zones and Acts, though? I mean they didn't specifically say zone and act, but that's what they clearly were. Sonic Adventure just had you go through all the acts of a zone in one session, and SA2 shuffled around the order, with a hero playing one act and the villain the other. They even listed the acts for each zone right next to each other in multiplayer to make it even more clear. You can say there was some sort of illusion that there wasn't a zone/act structure, but the games never really abandoned that formula.
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Re: Will the other characters ever be playable again?

Postby Azul » Sun Oct 18, 2015 12:27 pm

Penguin God wrote:The Adventure games did use the Zones and Acts, though? I mean they didn't specifically say zone and act, but that's what they clearly were. Sonic Adventure just had you go through all the acts of a zone in one session, and SA2 shuffled around the order, with a hero playing one act and the villain the other. They even listed the acts for each zone right next to each other in multiplayer to make it even more clear. You can say there was some sort of illusion that there wasn't a zone/act structure, but the games never really abandoned that formula.


That's almost exactly what I just said. :?

The Shadow Imperator wrote:...Um, no. It is not unique whatsoever. Look at Mario. Same format, just substitute "worlds" and "levels" instead of Zones and Acts.

Slipped my mind entirely. :oops:
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Re: Will the other characters ever be playable again?

Postby LBD_Nytetrayn » Mon Oct 19, 2015 9:22 am

The Shadow Imperator wrote:...Um, no. It is not unique whatsoever. Look at Mario. Same format, just substitute "worlds" and "levels" instead of Zones and Acts.


Unless something changed recently, the technical vernacular would be "areas" rather than "levels." ;)

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Re: Will the other characters ever be playable again?

Postby Spinehog » Tue Oct 20, 2015 2:24 pm

LBD_Nytetrayn wrote:I wouldn't mind, though I'd like if they kept to more of a "can run the same levels as Sonic, but can do x or y instead of z" kind of thing.

--LBD "Nytetrayn"


Do not want.

I think the gameplay style your describing works fantastic in 2d (IE: 3&K and Advance), but in the 3d games I much prefer stronger contrast between how everyone plays.

I'd prefer if additional characters where used as alternate ways to complete each of Sonic's stages. Characters still play different from Sonic, but you don't have to use them unless you want a %100 completion, or "Good Ending" or whatever.

..But I'm also a huge Knuckles/Rouge treasure hunting fan, so maybe my opinion is void.
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Re: Will the other characters ever be playable again?

Postby GentlemanX » Tue Oct 20, 2015 3:51 pm

It partially depends on what someone means when they say they "don't have to play as other characters if they don't want". Every single Sonic game starts with Sonic as the first character you can play as. Sonic Adventure begins with his story, he's the first character you play as in Adventure 2 (should you choose Hero Story before Dark), All of the heroes teams play the same, you start with his story in 06, The first Unleashed stage is during the day, etc. Now, SA2 switches between characters, as does Unleashed, and 06 sometimes has other gameplay styles during stages, and Heroes just plays somewhat different entirely, but SA1 utilizes this method where someone can just play the game as Sonic and never once use another character; they just don't get to experience those character's story modes or Super Sonic's story. Is that the preferred method? Because SA1 still got slammed for the other gameplay styles.
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Re: Will the other characters ever be playable again?

Postby LBD_Nytetrayn » Tue Oct 20, 2015 4:15 pm

Spinehog wrote:
LBD_Nytetrayn wrote:I wouldn't mind, though I'd like if they kept to more of a "can run the same levels as Sonic, but can do x or y instead of z" kind of thing.

--LBD "Nytetrayn"


Do not want.

I think the gameplay style your describing works fantastic in 2d (IE: 3&K and Advance), but in the 3d games I much prefer stronger contrast between how everyone plays.

I'd prefer if additional characters where used as alternate ways to complete each of Sonic's stages. Characters still play different from Sonic, but you don't have to use them unless you want a %100 completion, or "Good Ending" or whatever.


But this is pretty much what I was saying...? Instead of dashing through, Knuckles can dig, climb, and glide through, and Tails can fly and swim through. Or you can not use them...

I don't see the 2D/3D difference you speak of.

GentlemanX wrote:It partially depends on what someone means when they say they "don't have to play as other characters if they don't want". Every single Sonic game starts with Sonic as the first character you can play as. Sonic Adventure begins with his story, he's the first character you play as in Adventure 2 (should you choose Hero Story before Dark), All of the heroes teams play the same, you start with his story in 06, The first Unleashed stage is during the day, etc. Now, SA2 switches between characters, as does Unleashed, and 06 sometimes has other gameplay styles during stages, and Heroes just plays somewhat different entirely, but SA1 utilizes this method where someone can just play the game as Sonic and never once use another character; they just don't get to experience those character's story modes or Super Sonic's story. Is that the preferred method? Because SA1 still got slammed for the other gameplay styles.


Probably because you're only seeing 1/6 or so of the game by going with just Sonic, and it seems a bit short that way.

--LBD "Nytetrayn"
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Re: Will the other characters ever be playable again?

Postby linebyline » Tue Oct 20, 2015 4:51 pm

Yeah, I'm going to go out on a limb and say that something isn't optional if you can't beat the game without it.

S&K (and/or S3&K) is an odd duck, as it has multiple stories that each have their own endings. You're not missing a One True Ending if you only play as one character. It's just that you don't get to see Knuckles' story if you don't play as Sonic, and vice-versa. I guess you could count that either way.

Still, since Sonic has several levels that Knuckles barely visits, I'm somewhat confident in saying that you're still missing out on substantial portions of the game if you just play as Knuckles.

I think Advance 3 did a reasonably good job: You could stick to just Sonic and Tails and still see the whole story, but there were still benefits to playing as Knuckles, Amy, and Cream. (I'd like to see the amount of character-dependent paths taken a bit further than in Advance 3, to provide a bit more incentive to explore, but overall it wasn't bad.)
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Re: Will the other characters ever be playable again?

Postby Spinehog » Thu Oct 22, 2015 11:35 am

LBD_Nytetrayn wrote:
Spinehog wrote:
LBD_Nytetrayn wrote:I wouldn't mind, though I'd like if they kept to more of a "can run the same levels as Sonic, but can do x or y instead of z" kind of thing.

--LBD "Nytetrayn"


Do not want.

I think the gameplay style your describing works fantastic in 2d (IE: 3&K and Advance), but in the 3d games I much prefer stronger contrast between how everyone plays.

I'd prefer if additional characters where used as alternate ways to complete each of Sonic's stages. Characters still play different from Sonic, but you don't have to use them unless you want a %100 completion, or "Good Ending" or whatever.


But this is pretty much what I was saying...? Instead of dashing through, Knuckles can dig, climb, and glide through, and Tails can fly and swim through. Or you can not use them...

I don't see the 2D/3D difference you speak of.

GentlemanX wrote:It partially depends on what someone means when they say they "don't have to play as other characters if they don't want". Every single Sonic game starts with Sonic as the first character you can play as. Sonic Adventure begins with his story, he's the first character you play as in Adventure 2 (should you choose Hero Story before Dark), All of the heroes teams play the same, you start with his story in 06, The first Unleashed stage is during the day, etc. Now, SA2 switches between characters, as does Unleashed, and 06 sometimes has other gameplay styles during stages, and Heroes just plays somewhat different entirely, but SA1 utilizes this method where someone can just play the game as Sonic and never once use another character; they just don't get to experience those character's story modes or Super Sonic's story. Is that the preferred method? Because SA1 still got slammed for the other gameplay styles.


Probably because you're only seeing 1/6 or so of the game by going with just Sonic, and it seems a bit short that way.

--LBD "Nytetrayn"


I was thinking we differ on the aspect of the other playable characters "being near/as fast" as Sonic.
In the 2D Sonic games it never truly bothered me that everyone from Knuckles to Cream can keep pace with Sonic, but in a 3D environment I feel a greater need for distinction among characters.

@Gent X
I think the problem with previous games that got slammed, is just how much content was locked behind other characters. The Sonic Adventure games where, at most 1/3 Sonic? Even with Sonic Unleashed, I think most fans where less peeved at the inclusion of the Werehog, and more annoyed that again, less than 1/3rd of the game where day stages.

In the concept I was pitching,
Even if you couldn't get "Good Ending" without playing every level again as another character (say, Sonic's story has you hunt down Eggman. Playing as a stage's alt-character gets you the zones Emerald), at least speed purists would be getting every stage. Granted, this still wouldn't please everyone, but keeping Alt players completely optional seems like a mistake from a development aspect. If other playable characters are being that shoved into the corner, it really is more practical for Sonic Team to stick to focusing all of their work on Sonic himself.
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Re: Will the other characters ever be playable again?

Postby LBD_Nytetrayn » Thu Oct 22, 2015 5:47 pm

Nah, I wouldn't want the other guys to be as fast. Plus, Sonic has the boost. Aside from maybe Blaze or Shadow, that should be exclusive to him.

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Re: Will the other characters ever be playable again?

Postby Village » Thu Oct 22, 2015 6:21 pm

LBD_Nytetrayn wrote:Nah, I wouldn't want the other guys to be as fast. Plus, Sonic has the boost. Aside from maybe Blaze or Shadow, that should be exclusive to him.

--LBD "Nytetrayn"

Sonics boost is iirc his chaos control abilty.

I think shadows should be when you press that button time slows down. Shadow doesnt go the "fastest" he just makes you molasses.
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