Ken Penders Early cover for Sonic issue 47

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Re: Ken Penders Early cover for Sonic issue 47

Postby Meliden » Sun Mar 29, 2015 8:11 pm

SimonSays wrote:Speaking of, is "Whitey" supposed to be a parody of someone specific in the trials? My knowledge of the OJ stuff only goes as far as the events and the lawyers and "If I Did It".


Apparently some people thought the police were framing OJ because of racism and used that term to describe them, whitey is just a derogatory term for white people.

Which is even more unfortunate because of Sonic's American voice actor at the time.
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Re: Ken Penders Early cover for Sonic issue 47

Postby SonicBlueRanger » Sun Mar 29, 2015 8:12 pm

SimonSays wrote:
Meliden wrote:And someone theorised that Whitey was what eventually became Drago. Wasn't Endgame his first appearance?

That was stated by Ken himself (bad language in link), that the wolf in the bottom left later became Drago. Speaking of, is "Whitey" supposed to be a parody of someone specific in the trials? My knowledge of the OJ stuff only goes as far as the events and the lawyers and "If I Did It".


Yeah sorry about that. I swear more on Twitter than I do on here (Obviously)especially when mad.

IDK, I'm not that upset by the cover itself considering it wasn't the final cover. A lot of the process of writing is refining crap ideas into better ones. I mean, granted, this one goes over the moon in terms of being tacky and tasteless, even for a starting point. But along the way someone realized that, it got changed, and so it's not what people had to pay for. It IS unacceptable, which is why it wasn't accepted. I'm really curious who nixed that one, whether it was the editor or Ken revising the story later on. I'm more bothered that he's defending it in present day as something that's not offensive. Some pieces of comic trivia are better off staying buried.


It doesn't really matter that it didn't make print. The problem is this was an idea Penders had and thought "Yeah I can totally do this. This is okay." Well that's my issue with it.
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Re: Ken Penders Early cover for Sonic issue 47

Postby jazzflower92 » Sun Mar 29, 2015 8:20 pm

Okay, so when the OJ trials happened I was actually a toddler so I missed all the hoopla.

But I agree what was Penders' thinking when he thought this would make a good cover. I could see some nasty letters from parents saying this inappropriate to put in a kid's comic. With all he got away during his years as head writer I am actually surprised that someone put their foot down when he almost put this out.
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Re: Ken Penders Early cover for Sonic issue 47

Postby TurboTailz » Sun Mar 29, 2015 8:51 pm

Betz! wrote:
Dejiko wrote:...not funny, Betz. Not funny.

That was what went through my mind when they said the name. Forgive me if I truly don't know anything about this case.
squeakyboots13 wrote:(Comes back in thread) Anyone who doesn't know what the OJ Simpson trial is can easily google it. No need to be making jokes about it. (Leaves thread again.)


Not like it wasn't serious in the first place :roll:. It was clever though.
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Re: Ken Penders Early cover for Sonic issue 47

Postby SimonSays » Sun Mar 29, 2015 11:06 pm

Meliden wrote:
SimonSays wrote:Speaking of, is "Whitey" supposed to be a parody of someone specific in the trials? My knowledge of the OJ stuff only goes as far as the events and the lawyers and "If I Did It".


Apparently some people thought the police were framing OJ because of racism and used that term to describe them, whitey is just a derogatory term for white people.

Which is even more unfortunate because of Sonic's American voice actor at the time.

I understand that use of the term. I just didn't know if it was a nickname referring to someone in particular involved in the case (mostly because of its appearance in the modern day Whitey Bulger trials), and everything else on the cover has a real life counterpart. Admittedly that makes it a lot tackier if it's not based on someone, but instead is the embodiment of derogatory slang. It's so... unnecessary.

SonicBlueRanger wrote: It doesn't really matter that it didn't make print. The problem is this was an idea Penders had and thought "Yeah I can totally do this. This is okay." Well that's my issue with it.

I don't know, everyone has those moments where they have just a genuinely stupid idea and don't see anything wrong with it until a few days later, when they're like "oh yeah, maybe I shouldn't do that and that's actually really really bad." It never got used, so that moment of realization occurred for someone at some point in the issue's development. When you're just flinging stuff at the wall to see what sticks in the idea phase, there's going to be some dung heaps in there too, and I don't hold that against anyone so long as it's corrected before the final product.

I DO fault him for thinking it was okay to show it off and defend in any capacity 20 years later. Instead of saying "look at this embarrassing baby photo of one of the comic's biggest arcs, yay revision, i heart my editors" it's "so topical and appropriate for Sonic, the kids would've loved it only slightly less than what they got!" Or better yet, not share it at all. The fact that he still doesn't seem to "get it" even today makes me think it was Gabrie that called for the changes and not Ken. Which is pretty remarkable considering the holocaust and Nazi quotes that managed to slip into the book on other occasions.
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Re: Ken Penders Early cover for Sonic issue 47

Postby Tcat » Sun Mar 29, 2015 11:35 pm

Mavrickindigo wrote:
Tcat wrote:Ford....bronco? .....like.... The car?

The Car OJ was in, yes

I see I'm showing my age/apathy. Aside from the glove thing I never paid attention to that trial. Yeah, glad that never got through.

I wasn't even sure Ford made the Bronco, either. ;p
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Re: Ken Penders Early cover for Sonic issue 47

Postby jazzflower92 » Mon Mar 30, 2015 1:44 am

We can all rest easy that Archie comics will never allow this man to write another word again.
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Re: Ken Penders Early cover for Sonic issue 47

Postby NiTROACTiVE » Mon Mar 30, 2015 1:59 am

Well, that was certainly interesting there indeed. I also understand why the cover never became the final cover for the issue.

I also remember hearing about some parody cover for one of the Endgame issues (STH #47-#50) that this reminded me of which I think that Kureejii Lea brought up. Does anyone know where that was talked about?
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Re: Ken Penders Early cover for Sonic issue 47

Postby Kellox » Mon Mar 30, 2015 8:04 am

It's quite untasteful let me leave it at that, it doesn't help that Ken is trying to defend himself by arguing that Endgame sold very well. That's also in poor taste.

Also did he tried once again made up a reason why he tried to kill of Sally Acorn? I'm starting to get pretty fed up with him changing his story surrounding his motivates to kill a major character, from her comic books didn't sold well, her father can take her place, he disliked the idea of Mobuis being ruled by a king and queen and Sally not being ''cool enough'' to keep up with Sonic.
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Re: Ken Penders Early cover for Sonic issue 47

Postby 009* » Mon Mar 30, 2015 10:24 am

Kellox wrote:It's quite untasteful let me leave it at that, it doesn't help that Ken is trying to defend himself by arguing that Endgame sold very well. That's also in poor taste.

Also did he tried once again made up a reason why he tried to kill of Sally Acorn? I'm starting to get pretty fed up with him changing his story surrounding his motivates to kill a major character, from her comic books didn't sold well, her father can take her place, he disliked the idea of Mobuis being ruled by a king and queen and Sally not being ''cool enough'' to keep up with Sonic.

If the Knuckles book is any indication, he probably just really wanted to replace her with an OC.
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Re: Ken Penders Early cover for Sonic issue 47

Postby jazzflower92 » Mon Mar 30, 2015 11:07 am

And the guy has the nerve to say that he is progressive which at this point is an informed ability rather than truth.
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Re: Ken Penders Early cover for Sonic issue 47

Postby DC » Mon Mar 30, 2015 12:21 pm

jazzflower92 wrote:Okay, so when the OJ trials happened I was actually a toddler so I missed all the hoopla.

But I agree what was Penders' thinking when he thought this would make a good cover. I could see some nasty letters from parents saying this inappropriate to put in a kid's comic. With all he got away during his years as head writer I am actually surprised that someone put their foot down when he almost put this out.


It is a good thing you are too young to remember the OJ Simpson trail. Yeah, I do agree it is a good thing that didn't become the final cover.

Speaking of Ken Penders trying kill off Sally, the explanation I read is one of the reasons I became a hard core Sonic and Sally fan because it made me angry(she was holding Sonic back).
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Re: Ken Penders Early cover for Sonic issue 47

Postby jazzflower92 » Mon Mar 30, 2015 12:40 pm

DC wrote:
jazzflower92 wrote:Okay, so when the OJ trials happened I was actually a toddler so I missed all the hoopla.

But I agree what was Penders' thinking when he thought this would make a good cover. I could see some nasty letters from parents saying this inappropriate to put in a kid's comic. With all he got away during his years as head writer I am actually surprised that someone put their foot down when he almost put this out.


It is a good thing you are too young to remember the OJ Simpson trail. Yeah, I do agree it is a good thing that didn't become the final cover.

Speaking of Ken Penders trying kill off Sally, the explanation I read is one of the reasons I became a hard core Sonic and Sally fan because it made me angry(she was holding Sonic back).


I wonder if Pender's secretly has a dislike for Sally. He really was gung ho about killing her off.
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Re: Ken Penders Early cover for Sonic issue 47

Postby TurboTailz » Mon Mar 30, 2015 12:50 pm

jazzflower92 wrote:
DC wrote:
jazzflower92 wrote:Okay, so when the OJ trials happened I was actually a toddler so I missed all the hoopla.

But I agree what was Penders' thinking when he thought this would make a good cover. I could see some nasty letters from parents saying this inappropriate to put in a kid's comic. With all he got away during his years as head writer I am actually surprised that someone put their foot down when he almost put this out.


It is a good thing you are too young to remember the OJ Simpson trail. Yeah, I do agree it is a good thing that didn't become the final cover.

Speaking of Ken Penders trying kill off Sally, the explanation I read is one of the reasons I became a hard core Sonic and Sally fan because it made me angry(she was holding Sonic back).


I wonder if Pender's secretly has a dislike for Sally. He really was gung ho about killing her off.


Who knows, but knowing him he probably had Sonic getting together with some female echidna. In the end Sega would've wanted Sally to be revive at some point.
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Re: Ken Penders Early cover for Sonic issue 47

Postby Mordum » Mon Mar 30, 2015 3:22 pm

jazzflower92 wrote:And the guy has the nerve to say that he is progressive which at this point is an informed ability rather than truth.


I feel like he should be cut some slack for singlehandedly saving the Echidna people from complete genocide.
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